Growing up, many of us might be told there’s a right way to be—in terms of success, appearance, and behavior. Author and speaker Sheena Yap Chan experienced that growing up and feels that within Asian cultures, there exists a formidable pressure to be perfect, to excel, to never falter. But what if those very expectations, rigid and unyielding, are the very strings that bind our potential?
Embracing Imperfection
Sheena Yap Chan knows this struggle deeply. Raised in a conservative Chinese family, she bore the weight of cultural expectations that demanded perfection. A pivotal moment from her childhood—failing kindergarten simply because she colored outside the lines—shaped her long-held beliefs about failure and imperfection. This early experience drove her to strive for constant perfection, a pursuit that delayed her own success and happiness.
But through her personal development journey, Yap Chan discovered the power of embracing imperfections. “It’s about forging your own path and challenging the norms,” she explains. By accepting that imperfection is a part of human experience, she learned to self-validate rather than seek external approval, a shift monumental in her journey toward genuine confidence.
Representation Matters
The absence of Asian role models in the media during her upbringing profoundly impacted Yapchan’s sense of identity. Growing up in a predominantly Caucasian environment in Canada, she often felt like an outsider. “I felt ashamed of being Asian,” she recalls, underscoring how the lack of representation affected her self-confidence.
Through initiatives like her podcast, “The Tao of Self Confidence,” and her bestselling books, Yapchan has become a beacon of representation. Her work shines a spotlight on Asian women, amplifying their stories and victories. By providing a platform for these voices, she’s helping dismantle stereotypes while encouraging others to embrace their cultural identity.
Bridging the Confidence Gap
Despite initial hesitation, Yap Chan’s journey writing and publishing her first book was driven by a desire to offer representation and inspire confidence. Her upcoming book, “Bridging the Confidence Gap: How Empowered Women Change the World,” set for release in May 2025, promises to further this mission. The aim is clear: to address the unique challenges women face in building self-confidence, especially within the framework of cultural pressures.
“Confidence is not a one-size-fits-all,” Yapchan emphasizes, highlighting the importance of understanding our personality styles and confidence levels. By speaking openly about her struggles and breakthroughs, she encourages others to look within, to foster their inner strength, and to rewrite their narratives.
Sheena Yap Chan’s story is a testament to the beauty of imperfection and the vital importance of representation. It’s never too late to pursue your ambitions, challenge cultural norms, and embrace your true self. To follow more of these inspiring journeys and get exclusive content, join our email newsletter. Embrace the change, elevate your confidence, and let’s navigate this journey together.
Cultural Representation | Interview Transcript Sheena Yap Chan with Amy Stone | The Art of Imperfect Adulting | January 2025
Amy [00:00:03]:
Sheena Yapchan, welcome to Imperfect Adulting.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:00:07]:
Hey, Amy, thank you so much for having me here. It’s such an honor to be here today. So super excited about our conversation.
Amy [00:00:13]:
I love it. All right, are you ready for a fun chat? Let’s do it.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:00:16]:
I’m ready when you are.
Amy [00:00:17]:
All right, so I call the show the Art of Imperfect Adulting. And you actually pitched me a topic that included imperfection as an idea in it. So how in the world could I ever say no to that? Nicely done. So let’s dive in. Share. We are going to talk about your. How your cultural and your ethnic heritage impacted your personal ideas about perfection and probably other things as well. So share with. Let’s start with sharing with the audience as little or as much as you want about your heritage.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:00:49]:
Yeah, for sure. So, you know, I was born in the Philippines. I’m Chinese. Filipino. So I did not only grow up in one Asian culture, but two Asian cultures, right? Filipino and Chinese. And I come a. Come from a very conservative Chinese family. So, you know, in Asian culture, we’re taught to live one way of doing things. We always had to show up being the perfect daughter, sister, wife, friend, grandmother, whatever it is. And that really hurts us, right, because we feel like we’re trapped. We go through so much trauma. We don’t talk about the things that we go through. In fact, even until now, my grandma will never share soul of what happened to her. We know we’ve she’s gone through some trauma, but she will never say it because we’ve been conditioned to not talk about it. You know, if we don’t talk about it, it never happened. But of course, of course, you know, things are going to pop up. There’s going to be triggers. Your body is going to tell you something that you need to let this out. And so I always had to feel it. I always had to, you know, show up as perfect as well. And it wasn’t easy, right, because especially in Asian culture, they love to compare their children to see who’s better, who has the better things, who graduated first, who became valedictorian, who has the better job, who got married, who had the better wedding. And that can take a toll on us as well. And so especially growing up in Toronto, you know, I moved to Toronto when I was 7, and I think there really started my. My issues because I never saw anybody in the media that looked like me. So I felt like I had to show up a different way or I had to be a certain person in order to feel beautiful in Order to feel accepted. You know, I longed for blonde hair and blue eyes to feel more beautiful and accepted. I was ashamed of my own culture because it wasn’t prevalent back then in Toronto. I mean, Toronto is a very multicultural city, don’t get me wrong. But you know, of course I still felt like an outsider in this country. And. And another part of my life that I usually share with, you know, in interviews was that in kindergarten in the Philippines, I actually failed kindergarten for coloring outside the lines of a photo. So.
Amy [00:02:54]:
Really?
Sheena Yap Chan [00:02:55]:
Yeah. So I had this photo that I was trying to color it. I colored outside the lines. The teacher gave me a brand new, brand new photo to color again, but I still colored it within without like, you know, outside the lines. And because of that, I failed kindergarten. I had to move to another school and redo kindergarten all over again. And I didn’t realize how that one moment in my life really affected how I viewed life in my adult life. Right. Like, I used to think that everything I touch, I was just in constant failure. I was an instant failure. I resisted a lot, and I always felt like I had to have everything perfect to a T before I even started. And you know what happened? I just delayed my own success. And so it wasn’t until like a self development class or seminar in Hawaii where I realized that I didn’t fail. You know, just one person told me I fail. But one person’s view is not my absolute truth, right. I realized that I was just meant to color outside the lines. I wasn’t meant to live how my culture has told me to live, day in and day out. You know, we’ve been taught one way of living for generations, and that’s all they know too. I can’t fault the older generation because they just know what they’re being taught, Right? And you know, because of this, we go through so much confidence issues, so much unresolved trauma that doesn’t help us. Right? And of course, for me, trauma is really important to work through it because we can’t show up as our best self. Another thing we’re taught to do is that, you know, our parents gave us life. They do everything for us, which I’m very grateful for, of course. Right. But their one thing is that you do everything they tell you to they tell you to do. Right? Like every single thing. So that was a big battle too, between me and my parents, because especially forging my own path, you know, they didn’t see that. They’re like, that’s, that does. That’s not how it works. And I’m like, according to who? Right, right. You know, we come to North America for better opportunities and not that working a job is a bad thing. If you love your job, I think that’s great. But not everyone loves their job. Right. If you want something more, if you feel like you can make a dent in this world or make a name for yourself, then we should go for it. Right? We’re, we’re in the land of opportunity. Right. And there’s so many opportunities out there. But as women, sometimes we are too scared to seize that opportunity. And because of that, you know, men have more confidence than women. We face, we face this huge confidence gap that we need to tackle because if not that, that gap will widen. Right. They said it’s going to take at least, at least 130 years for gender parity to be achieved. So that’s like five generations before we could see that. And that’s the least amount of time. I feel like it’s going to take longer just with what’s been going on in the world. And I know I talk about Asian culture, but I know there’s other cultures who go through similar situations.
Amy [00:05:44]:
Yeah. No. Wow. You. That was like a masterclass in a lot of things. I. To pick a spot for where to. To where to jump in. So you talked about the, the confidence gap. And one of my mentors does a lot of talking about the gaps. So we talk about we have the wage gap, we have the confidence gap, we have the leisure gap, we have the pleasure gap, all kind of things like that. It’s a lot of, a lot of stuff to think about. And you talked about the impact of trauma and generational cycles. We’ll dig into a bunch of that. Right. So you mentioned that you were born in Pop Quiz for Amy, as I remember what you just said, the Philippines. Right. And you went to kindergarten in the Philippines. At what point did you move? Like, tell us, tell us when that happened.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:06:26]:
Yeah, I moved in July of 1989. I was seven years old.
Amy [00:06:30]:
Right. Not far after kindergarten then.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:06:32]:
Yeah. I did not know Canada existed. I was wondering where we were going. I thought we were going to America to go to Disneyland. And my father’s like, we’re going to Canada. And I was like, what is Canada? Where is that? Like, is that America? And so I never depends on how.
Amy [00:06:46]:
You look at the map. Right?
Sheena Yap Chan [00:06:48]:
Yeah. Yeah.
Amy [00:06:50]:
So, all right, so you moved when you were seven and you settled in Canada. What part of the world do you live in today?
Sheena Yap Chan [00:06:57]:
Still Canada. I live in Toronto, So been Here since.
Amy [00:07:01]:
Very nice. And tell us. So this. You are no longer 7 years old. You’re a little older than that. But tell us as much or as little as you want to about your family today.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:07:10]:
Yeah, I mean, I think, you know, our. My family, we’ve learned to talk more to each other. Right. Share what we’re going through. I think that’s really important. Before, we wouldn’t talk about anything. Right. We would just kind of brush it off and hopefully it goes away. But of course, that doesn’t happen. Right. Especially with my siblings, we talk things out, you know, as siblings. We fight, Right? Yeah, it’s normal to fight. But, you know, in the end, we talk it out, we figure it out, and we move it, move on. Because I don’t want the same thing to happen to, like, my nephews. I want and my nieces. I want them to be able to talk about the things they go through, talk about their issues and work through it versus just holding it in and having all these repressed feelings. And then you have, like, so much hatred for your own sibling because you weren’t able to share what you were feeling.
Amy [00:07:57]:
Absolutely. And we’ll come back to that, because I do. I want to talk about that impact of changing from over generations, because I think you have a really special sort of window on that because you’re researching it and writing about it and all of these things. So I feel like the idea or the concept, like the, you know, sort of the storyboard of the idea that Asian parents have very high standards for their children, and the comparison has. Has been pretty well established in modern literature, in books and movies and shows and things like that. I think that. So. But I do want to talk about that from your perspective as somebody who has, like, worked on thinking about it. Is that all right?
Sheena Yap Chan [00:08:37]:
Yeah.
Amy [00:08:37]:
Yeah, absolutely. Okay. So when we’re kids, when we’re little, like, so when you were in kindergarten, our concept of normal and what’s expected is just whatever we’re around. So if you like. So I grew up in New York City, and people would ask me when I moved out of the city, they were like, what was it like? Be a kid in the city? And I’m like, what? It’s a weird question. It was all I knew. It seemed to be totally normal, like, until I moved away. So when. When did you begin to become aware of the idea that what your expectations or what it was expected of you or the comparisons that you were seeing from the adults in your life wasn’t maybe the same as the other People who are around you in Canada, I.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:09:16]:
Think just, you know, being in different cultures, seeing, like, the majority of the population at the time was all Caucasian. Like, that’s all you ever saw in the media. That’s all you ever saw in magazines. And I always felt a lot smaller because I never had any, like, role models that look like me to look up to. And it was really hard. I think the first time I saw, you know, an all Asian cast in a movie was the Joy Luck Club.
Amy [00:09:39]:
Yeah. Oh, I just saw Amy Chan speak this past week.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:09:42]:
Nice. And then, you know, that was the first time I was like, oh, you know, there’s. There’s Asian women in the front, in the movies. Right. I even talk about that in my book, the Tab. Self confidence and talking about different examples of intergenerational trauma. Because, you know, the Joy Lock Club is all about complex relationships between mother and daughter that we all can relate to. And that was the first time that I felt like, you know, I wasn’t good enough because I didn’t have blonde hair, I didn’t have blue eyes, I had a flat nose. I looked totally different. You know, I was ashamed of being Asian. In fact, when I would go back home to visit family and friends, you know, I would. I personally would look down on everybody else because I was like, you’re from the Philippines, I’m from Canada. I’m better. And back then we didn’t know any better. Right. We just wanted to, you know, assimilate as well in Canada. You know, when you’re living in. In Canada and you want to assimilate to Canadian culture, but at the same time, your parents are trying to talk, talk to you or teach you still the Asian culture, it’s like you don’t even know where to go at times, or you’re, like, stuck in this little gray area. And then sometimes when you go back home, you know, how you speak to your elders, you know, what you may think is, like, something that’s really harmless to them. It’s disrespectful. Right. I remember just, you know, we were just talking and I shared my opinion on something. And, you know, in. In North America, we. We can freely share our opinions without being ostracized or being back then being canceled. Now it’s totally different. But when I shared that with my. My uncles at the time, you know, they were telling me I was disrespectful for speaking out of line, and I was like, oh, that’s interesting. Right? And so, yeah, I mean, I think not having Representation really affected my confidence because I just felt like I could only be a certain person and do a certain thing and have, like, this cap, not really realizing there’s no such thing as a cap, and you can go out there and do what you want. And I think this is why I do the work that I do, because I also want the current and future generations to realize, like, you can write a book, you can speak, you can forge your own path, like, you can do anything you set your mind to. And it doesn’t matter what age you’re at, because I’m already in my 40s. So, like, you know, especially women that are 40 and over, we’re always seeing that we have this, like, expiration date, but we don’t. Like, you can literally start at any given moment.
Amy [00:12:07]:
That is a really interesting thing. So I’m older than you, but it’s something I’ve been doing a lot of thinking about myself because I did what I think of as the parental pause, which is that I did take a break and really focus on my family for several years. And that’s. That can be followed. A lot of people follow that with the idea of, like, oh, my gosh, you know, did I just waste these, you know, give up on this stuff? So really questioning and pushing that. So this leads into a question that I have, which you may not have an answer, but I’m just going to give you permission to guess and speak authoritatively, even if you don’t have any idea. But in your opinion, do you think that there is a bit of a cultural shift about this idea of the relations between the cultures and the parents and the children and comparing and the high standards for the people who have left the home country. Do you think that that has shifted over the past couple decades or not?
Sheena Yap Chan [00:12:59]:
I think there has been some shift, especially with the popularity of Korean dramas, you know.
Amy [00:13:04]:
Oh, right, yes.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:13:05]:
You know, they’ve been very great at storytelling and especially in situations that I can relate to and everybody can relate to, because if you look at the audience for Korean dramas, it’s a very diverse audience. Like, I’ve never seen such a diverse audience, considering it’s not an American show. It’s everything is in Korean language. And, you know, it just talks about these really specific situations that can happen in real life, especially in mental health. Right. Mental health has been something that we’re not taught to talk about. It’s been a taboo. Sometimes our elder generation thinks that it’s not real. And so being able to have, like, these open discussions about mental Health has slowly shifted and you know, help people realize, you know, what we’re going through, a mental health crisis or issue and you know, it’s okay that we’re going through that. Like it’s okay not to be okay because we’re human. We’re not going to be a hundred percent confidence. We’re not always going to be 100. You know, like on top of everything, there’s days where we just want to hide from the world. So I do see the shift, you know, because of media. And that’s why media is so powerful. That’s why having representation is so powerful. And even the pandemic, right, the pandemic was a big wake up call that, hey, we need to talk about mental health. We need to talk about people’s mental health, what they’re going through. Especially being locked, locked up for what, like two, two years at most, you know, it started to normalize. Talking about mental health being okay to say I’m seeking a mental health therapist because especially in Asian culture, if we said we were going to go see a mental health therapist, we would be deemed as, you know, crazier. Something is wrong with us when, when it’s the total opposite, right? Like we just need to work on our mental well being. It’s kind of like if you’re working out, you go to the gym to work on your body to do sit ups or cardio or weightlifting because if you don’t, then you know, your body’s not performing at its peak. So it’s the same thing. You’re just maintaining mental, mental wellness.
Amy [00:15:07]:
Yeah, no, that’s, that’s an excellent point I saw. Now so these days I live in Miami and so we are dominant immigrant culture is Hispanic and Haitian and so they there, they have that same challenge that the earlier generate. The older generations are very resistant to the idea that you would have anxiety or depression or that you would need to reach out for. So it’s interesting how that crosses over a lot of, a lot of things. Okay, so the shift from how we are parented to, to the way we want to like interact with younger generations, whether it’s children or nieces or nephews or just setting the standard for, you know, whatever it is, right. We call that generational cycles. And you referred to that when you were talking about the confidence gap and how long it would take to like bridge it. So what are your, like, what are some of your thoughts on, on how that works and how to change it? Like, so do you, you know, do you see other people that Are your peers, like, so if you have kids, which I don’t know if you mentioned, or if you see other people doing it, like, how do you see people making that adjustment or choosing not to? Are people choosing to continue to parent with respect and honor to holding up old traditions of competitive nature and high standards, or are people saying, hey, listen, let’s make a shift and adjust this for future generations?
Sheena Yap Chan [00:16:25]:
Yeah, I mean, that’s a great question. I don’t have kids. I do. This is a nephew. So those are the closest things. I think some of the things that I’ve done differently was let them express how they feel, right? Like, if they are crying, I will let them cry, right? It’s better they just cry it out than keeping it in, right? And just talking and kind of encouraging them, letting them know they can do anything they want. So, you know, I’ll ask my nephew, what do you want to be when you grow up? You know, he’s like, I want to be a race car driver. I’m like, that’s awesome. Let’s f. You know, you can be a race car driver instead. Back then, especially in Asian culture, if you’re like telling your parents, like, you want to be a race car driver or an artist, you know, like, how are you going to put money, money on the table? Are you going to feed your family? How are you going to make money? Like, everything was always about making money. Even though there is an avenue to make money, it just wasn’t the realistic way of doing it because, you know, you were told to be like a doctor, lawyer, accountant, like a very specific profession. So anything that’s like a little bit creative or out of the box, it’s always like, how are you going to make money? So those are some of the things I’ve seen. And you know, it’s also my friends, you know, everyone’s developmental stage for kids, you know, it’s very different, right? Not everyone grow up the same way, right? Some people, some kids will talk when they’re two, some will talk at five. And so instead of worrying about it, you know, we kind of just kind of let it go and that time will come. Because even myself, I didn’t even start talking until I was five and my parents thought something was wrong with me. Of course, at 5, at 5 years old, I didn’t say a word. And so it’s, you know, for any parent that they would worry, right? Even now a days, like, you know, they’re going to be like, you need to check your child, make sure you.
Amy [00:18:11]:
Would have been to 45 specialists before you turn three and a half. Absolutely.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:18:15]:
Yeah. Right. And sometimes we just develop late. That’s all. Like, there’s nothing wrong with that. So learning to just let it go, of course, you know, you can go to the doctor just to check in, just to make sure everything’s good. But really, you know, some, some kids just develop late. That, that’s really it.
Amy [00:18:31]:
I did one of. So I have two step kids and two kids. And I can still remember when one of my step kids, he wanted to be a professional baseball player. Specifically, he wanted to play for the New York Yankees. No pressure there. And I remember the day that he was sitting in the back of the car and he said, why doesn’t everybody play for the New York Yankees? And he was making that discovery on his own that his dream may be harder to achieve than he might have thought. You know, it’s hard, it’s. It’s hard to watch somebody have a dream and, you know, you don’t want to squash it. The other thing I remember talking about, the talking one of my kids, the school was like, hey, we think you should consider speech therapy. And so then we checked with a member of the family who is speech therapist, and she was like, this child has no teeth. Like, you know, like, this is the wrong time. Like, all of her teeth had like fallen out. Like that part where you miss all your teeth, they’re like, this is not the time for speech therapy. Like, this is, this is. She doesn’t have any teeth yet. Let’s wait. And I just always think about that, that it was two different opinions. But it’s, it’s, it’s interesting. Neither of those are parental standards, but working with children and seeing how they interact and getting advice, it’s a, it feels like a lot of pressure to create things and change things for future generations because you, you know, it’s. I think that, and this partly probably comes from the way we learn things. Like we are taught in a school system to model what people tell us to do. And then anytime you turn around, you’re like, well, I’m not sure if I’m going to do it that way. That puts you in a spot of potential self doubt. Right?
Sheena Yap Chan [00:20:04]:
Yeah.
Amy [00:20:04]:
So that’s, so that’s okay. So you are very upfront about the fact that you feel like you had a lot of pressure put on you by your parents and that it’s a, it’s got some cultural elements. In what ways do you think that that pressure impacted you? You’ve talked about how it showed up in some. Some ways that were looking for representation, unsure things. What are some of the other ways that it showed up? And I’m specifically curious whether or not there were some positive ways that it could have showed up in how you move through your life.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:20:37]:
Yeah, I mean, you know, there’s good and bad in everything, right? I’m grateful that my parents brought us here and help us learn to be. How to be independent, how to think on the spot, how to, you know, adapt to different environments. I mean, we moved half across the world, right? That’s a big change. And at the same time, especially in Asian culture, one of the things we always want to do is just seek approval from our parents that what we’re doing is okay. So when I was forging my path, my confidence level was very low because I always felt like I needed approval from my parents first before doing anything right. And so I delayed my own success because I was like, you know, I don’t have a normal job. You know, what I’m doing is totally out of the box. It’s totally unconventional. Unconventional. And I don’t think my parents approve of this. So I was always scared that they were ashamed of me or not proud of me. And one day I was like, I need to let that approval go, right? Because I don’t even know if that’s true or not. Like, I’m just thinking of this in my head because, you know, we’ve been conditioned to just do everything our parents tell us to do, right? And it was hard for us to make a decision because every decision was laid out for us. Even when something as simple as, like, buying a car, right? I would normally go to my dad and ask him for car advice because he loves cars and, like, he knows more than I do. So that one time I decided to buy my car and made the decision all on my own. Like, he was so mad because he was like, why didn’t you ask me? I could have checked the car. I could have seen, like, if it was okay or not. And then he saw the car and then, like, pinpointed everything that was wrong with it. And I felt really bad because I was like, oh, I made a really bad decision. And then, like, an ex boyfriend at the time was like, you know what? It doesn’t matter if it was a good or bad decision. You actually made a decision all by yourself. And I was like, yeah, you’re right. Like, I did make a decision all by myself. And the car wasn’t that bad. It was running. It was still Great. You know, it. It served its purpose. And so, so the moment I let go of that approval, that’s when I can just show up and not really, like, it’s not saying not care, but just to let it go. Right. And, you know, the more you keep showing up and showing them what’s possible, like, they’ll come around. Right. Like when my book came out, like, my dad wrote, read the book. My mom’s, like, sharing it on social media. Like, she never shared anything about what I do, social media. So it’s, it’s, it’s. It’s funny how things change, right? And I know not everyone’s parents is gonna change their mind, of course, because everyone’s relationship is different, but you just never know, right? And if you have like a. A big purpose that’s going to create a really big impact for the, for, for the better, then we go for it. Is it easy? Of course not. That’s why, like, not everyone’s doing this. I mean, you know, there’s more bad times than good, actually. But the times that are good really just make everything worth it.
Amy [00:23:28]:
Yeah, no, that’s. It’s really, really well said. And there’s. That’s a lot there. So we’re going to shift a little bit. We’re going to talk about what you do, and I’m going to ask you how you got there. So it sounds like when you were a kid, your parents wanted you to take a traditional professional path. Doctor, lawyer, surgeon. What did you choose to do instead? Did you study those things or at what point did you veer away?
Sheena Yap Chan [00:23:53]:
I actually studied accounting and graduated from it in college. I was going to take my certification to be an accountant, and then I was like, I don’t know if I want to study for the next 10 years. Like, I was just looking at it, and I was already in my mid-20s, and I’m like, I just couldn’t picture myself studying. So I said, no, I’m not going to do it. I actually had an office job, you know, doing sales, you know, selling cardboard paper. And I was there for 12 years. And I actually liked what I did, but I just knew that there was something more out there for me. And then, of course, there’s office politics and things like that. And it wasn’t really until my aunt passed away from a horrific accident about 13 years ago that made me realize that I need to do something different. I need to go out there and really live my life, or else I’m just going to live with regrets. Um, and so, so I went for it. I didn’t know what I was doing. I had no plan B. I just decided to quit my job. My parents were mad. They were trying to give me an intervention, saying, like, what did you do? You were so you’re already successful. Why would you throw that away? So their definition of success was different from my definition of success. And of course, I went through this period where I was really lost. I didn’t know what I was doing. I was having this, like, you know, moment where I was feeling sorry for myself. And I realized, you know, one of the things I wanted to do was always have a voice for women, especially for Asian women, just because the representation was still very low. And so in 2015, I launched my podcast called the Tao Self Confidence, where I’ve interviewed over 800 women on this topic of confidence. And you know how podcasting is a labor of love. So labor of love. But at the same time, it’s still a very small platform compared to other media platforms. And I really want to create that visibility, show Asian women and beyond what’s possible. And so I said, I’m going to tap into different forms of media. And I didn’t know what that looked like. Right. And it wasn’t until the pandemic where, you know, I met a lady online asking me if I wanted to create a book, a co authored book, and I just said yes. I had no idea how to publish a book. I didn’t know what this book was going to look like. I just said yes because I knew it was going somewhere and we could figure it out. Right. Sometimes we’re afraid to say yes because we don’t know what that outcome would look like or we feel like we need to figure everything out before we say yes. Right?
Amy [00:26:13]:
No, absolutely. That’s my whole thing. Imperfection is the starting point. You have to, like, accept it so you can move forward 100% yes.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:26:20]:
So I said yes. I had no clue what’s going on. But we made the book. It came out. It was called Asian Women who Boss up. They had 18 stories of Asian women forging their own path as part of a book series. It came out in February of 2021. I used that book to spread my message. Create with, create relationships, get speaking engagements. And that led me to writing my first book with Wiley called the Tao of Self Confidence, A guide to moving beyond trauma and awakening the leader within. And even then, when I got approached by the publisher to write this book, I had my doubts because for once, I. For one thing, I never written a Book on my own.
Amy [00:26:55]:
But wait a minute. We’re gonna. We’re gonna hit pause for a second because you experienced, like, the dream. Like, the publisher came to you and said, sheena, please write this book. Because, like, the Especially more and more every day, people write the books, and then they go to the publisher. They’re like, please, please, please, please, please.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:27:12]:
Yeah, mine was totally different. I had to come up with an idea. I just had an outline.
Amy [00:27:17]:
Yeah.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:27:17]:
And they said, okay, that’s good.
Amy [00:27:19]:
That’s amazing.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:27:20]:
I had to write this book in less than three months for it to come out in May of 2023. But before that, I almost.
Amy [00:27:26]:
Which is also amazing. Oh, my God. Did you sleep? Did you, like, eat?
Sheena Yap Chan [00:27:29]:
I know.
Amy [00:27:30]:
Live in a closet.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:27:32]:
I went to Starbucks a lot. But before I said yes, I was actually very hesitant because they were like, we would love you to write a book on Asian and international leadership. And I’m like, what does that even mean? I don’t even know what a leader is. Like, I have no idea. Like, I don’t even think I’m leadership material. And this is why having a support system is really important, because they’re the ones who’s going to encourage you, like, write it. If you don’t write it, I’m going to be mad at you. I was like, okay, I’ll write it. Especially if I want representation. If I didn’t take this, if I didn’t do it, I’m the biggest hypocrite in the world. I complain about not having enough representation. And, yeah, I’m not going to take this opportunity. So again, I said yes. Not knowing what this book’s going to look like, not knowing what I’m going to write about, I just said yes. So. And especially coming from the Philippines to Canada, right? Like, when I first got here, I couldn’t speak English properly. I had to take English classes in school because I couldn’t form sentences properly. And so, you know, just because you feel like that’s a limitation, it’s actually not. So I hope that can help the audience out there who’s listening to this. So, yeah, I had the book come out, made it to the Wall Street Journal bestseller list. So it’s really cool to see this book, like, literally all over the world. Like, you know, my friend saw it in Australia, in Singapore. I got to go to the Philippines, and it was in the big. Like, in the biggest book retailer in the Philippines. You know, I got to show my grandma. So it was really cool to see that. And just to create that Change and, you know, women telling me how it’s helped them, especially in the realm of, like, trauma, because trauma is something we don’t talk about, right? Like, trauma is something that we just hold in. So I’ve had people tell me how they’ve had difficult conversations with their family members, be able to, you know, do things to heal through their trauma. Right. Because a lot of people are always like, how do you build confidence? And I’m like, what is really stopping you from building that confidence?
Amy [00:29:21]:
Right.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:29:21]:
Instead of asking, how do we build confidence? Let’s figure out the root cause and then we can move forward. And then late last year, I got approached by the publisher again to write my upcoming book, Bridging the Confidence Gap, How Empowered Women Change the World.
Amy [00:29:35]:
So that’s coming out soon?
Sheena Yap Chan [00:29:37]:
Yeah, it’s coming out May of 2025. It’s available for pre order, of course. But, you know, even them asking me to write the second book, I was like thinking, I already wrote one book. What am I going to write about? I don’t even know what I’m going to write about. Right. I said, yes, again, not knowing what was going to happen this time. They just, they just said, you just let us know. We already know you’re going to write something good. And that’s a lot of pressure, right? Considering you have your first book and you’re like, well, now the second book. What if I write the second book and it’s not good enough, Right?
Amy [00:30:06]:
Yes.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:30:07]:
So again, I had to send them an outline, figure it out, write it out, and then it’s coming out in May of 2025. So such a great story.
Amy [00:30:17]:
You know, both of the interviews I’ve done so far today have been people who’ve moved countries as children and had to overcome that cultural and divide, which is, I think, one of the things that’s so amazing. And you touched on this because in our lifetimes, you’re 40 and I’m 50. In our lifetimes, some of the gatekeeping has dropped from this. Like, so now there are more people talking about what are the challenges that immigrants face? What are the generational impacts of people who grow up in a country that doesn’t. Where they don’t look like everybody. Like the homogenization of the United States in the Midwest in the 1950s versus today, you know, and what is the role of that? So I think that. I think that that’s. I think these are amazing stories. I’m so happy you shared that. And I think you deserve unbelievable praise to have the, the courage to do it. It’s unfortunate that the push was a sad event in your family, but sometimes I say, I’m like, if there is a silver lining in the loss of somebody we love, sometimes it’s that it does show us that expiration date and get us to step our foot on the gas. Okay, so you’ve got the books, you’re working on a new book. You also have been so kind as to make a gift available for the audience, which is a personality quiz. And I’ll put the link for that in the show notes and in the email that goes to our audience. Tell us a little bit about it, what it is and why we should all take it.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:31:41]:
Yeah, it’s a self confidence personality test. So it’s just a couple questions. You’ll get your results right away and there’ll be a description as to what your self confidence personality style is. So it can help you in your career or in your personal life. So like you mentioned, it’ll be, it’ll be in the show notes and the links. And yeah, I mean a lot of people have taken in, they love the, they love, you know, getting the result and knowing what type of personality they have. And then if you need, you know, further help with uncovering that personality, then you can always, you can always connect with me. We can figure that out.
Amy [00:32:14]:
Awesome. That is very good. Okay, so we’re going to wrap this up now with three totally random questions. So the idea is that these are just for fun and give people another view of what you are like as a person. Get a little connection. The idea is that they’re rapid fire and you answer in just a few words. I do have to confess that 100% of the people who I’ve done this with have failed at keeping the answers short. So if you don’t keep the answer short, I’m not going to be upset, but that’s the goal. All right, so here we go. Do you enjoy eating out and if you do, do you have a favorite restaurant?
Sheena Yap Chan [00:32:46]:
Yes, I. Food. Food is our love language in Asian culture. So we love all things food wise. Right. And Toronto has such an amazing selection. When it comes to food, you can literally get every cuisine in the world. I mean, my favorite will always be Asian food, anything Asian food. Like I love. Sometimes when I go to the, when I go to the States and there’s like no Asian restaurants around, I just, I start getting anxiety because I start craving Asian food. So like when I come back to Toronto, I go to like my go to places and I just Feel like, whole again.
Amy [00:33:18]:
So that is wonderful. All right, very good. So you have a favorite. Do you have a favorite local haunt that you hit most often?
Sheena Yap Chan [00:33:24]:
And there’s so many. Like, like, way too many to mention.
Amy [00:33:27]:
Wait, you can’t pick one. Okay. I can’t put you on the spot.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:33:29]:
I can’t.
Amy [00:33:30]:
I will move on. I get it. Okay, so what. What is something that you do pretty much every day that you would call self care?
Sheena Yap Chan [00:33:40]:
One of the things I like doing is getting my steps in. I know that’s okay.
Amy [00:33:45]:
Yeah.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:33:46]:
Random. But I try to do 12,000 steps a day, and so that helps me out. Like, whether it’s taking a walk, working, working out, I’m able to, like, mind up or even go to for a jog. Like, it’s my form of meditation. So sometimes they might take it a little bit too obsessive. But, you know, I feel like I’ve hit a goal for the day when I see, like, 12,000 and more, so.
Amy [00:34:08]:
Very nice. How do you track it? Do you have a sports watch? Like, a watch?
Sheena Yap Chan [00:34:11]:
I just use my phone.
Amy [00:34:11]:
Yeah, you just use your phone. All right, very good, Very good. I’m like, I’m a lifetime, lifelong runner, so I’d like. It’s on my watch, and that’s how I do it, but that’s a big piece for me. Okay, so last one. Have you ever purchased something that you immediately regretted? And if so, what was it?
Sheena Yap Chan [00:34:27]:
Oh, my gosh. I think it’s sometimes just like coaching programs that you think it’s going to help you out and really, you know, you kind of regret it. But I believe everything happens for a reason. You know, it’s a learning lesson for you. You can figure out, you know, the type of entrepreneur you want to be and how you’re going to serve people and create that positive impact.
Amy [00:34:45]:
Yeah, I did a whole. A whole series where I call. I talked to a bunch of different coaches that, like the coaching programs through the lens. I call that what I call it snark, scams, and something, something. And because it’s. It’s hard. It’s. You could extend that to all of, like, the online shopping things. Like, you know, like, it’s hard to figure out what you’re getting and what you’re going to do. But I am like you. I don’t think I have anything in the online coaching space that I’ve bought where I. There are things that I probably would have skipped if I knew more, but where there wasn’t, like, a blessing in there, even if it was to watch out for people who do xyz. Like. I will consider that, like, and move on. All right, that. Those are. That was fun. And I feel like I got to know you more. That’s it for the interview today. I want to thank you very much, Gina, for being a very wonderful guest on the Imperfect adulting show.
Sheena Yap Chan [00:35:36]:
Well, thank you for having me. It was such a pleasure being here.